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  • How does Jesus return as a thief in the night?

    I started a thread four years ago on another forum in which Lou posted on several times. It was a fairly popular thread, with 9600 views to date. In fact, there was a sequel thread the following year. The question I had on my heart on both threads was simple. Namely, "How is Jesus able to return as a thief in the night, given all the earth shattering events written about in the Book of Revelation?" Lou will be transferring some of the more edifying posts from those two threads here. Hopefully this will be useful in raising additional questions and comments about his current thread on Revelation.

    Peace,

    Blane
    Last edited by Blane; October 23, 2014, 04:47 AM.

  • #2
    How is Jesus able to return as a thief in the night?

    Posted by Blane:

    The Book of Revelation is perhaps the most action packed book in the Bible. There are unprecedented signs, wonders, and judgments prophesied which must all be fulfilled, for scripture cannot be broken.

    I am have difficulty understanding how the return of Christ can occur as a thief in the night. However, Jesus makes that statement several times in scripture. The most profound such statement by Jesus seems to be Rev 16:15. In this verse, John is telling about the bowl judgments which bring catastrophic judgments upon those with the mark of the beast, upon the sea, fountains of waters, the sun, and the seat of the beast. Next, the sixth bowl allows four beasts to be loosed and miracle working demons to go forth. Then, at exactly this point (Rev 16:15) Jesus says, "Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest they walk naked, and they see his shame." I would like for the Lord to open my eyes and my understanding that I might understand how he can return as a thief, relative to the events he is speaking of in Revelation.

    We are all watching for signs and events to better understand where we are on God's timeline. But are we observing these events with spiritual eyes and ears, or are we primarily focused on the physical signs of the times? Surely both are important, but hearing the voice of the Holy spirit is critically important.

    When I believed in the pre trib rapture theory, I had no difficulty with the concept of Jesus returning as a thief in the night. However, scripture does not support a pre trib rapture of the church.

    Here are some thoughts I have considered:

    Is it possible that much of the Book of Revelation had already been fulfilled? For example, in the middle ages the bubonic plague killed one third of the known world. Some have suggested that the Abomination of Desolation occurred in 70 AD, prior to the destruction of the second temple (When a pig was sacrificed on the altar by the invading army).

    Is it possible that when Jesus says he will return as a thief in the night, he means that he will return to begin judgment on the earth suddenly and without warning? Therefore, judgment will start suddenly, like a thief breaking into a house violently. In other words, the events of Rev 13 will begin to unfold suddenly and without warning, but will continue for 42 months, as prophesied. Then the end will come, when Jesus returns to throw the beast and false prophet into the lake of fire, slay the wicked, and lock Satan away for 1000 years.

    What are your thoughts on this? How is Jesus able to return suddenly, like a thief in the night, when so much seems to need to occur beforehand? Scripture does not contradict scripture. What are your thoughts.

    1611

    Comment


    • #3
      Posted by Katherine

      The garments Jesus is referring to is His robe of Righteousness that the saints wear. Many people who are wearing these robes, do so unworthy. When Jesus comes, He will come this time as Judge! As far a Todd [email protected]#$%$ is concerned, he is wearing one of these robes! We are told in Matthew 7:22 these words of the Lord;
      Matthew 7:21-27 (King James Version)

      21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

      22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

      23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

      24Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:

      25And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.

      26And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:

      27And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.



      I believe that the scriptures have more then one meaning to them. If someone claims to have received Jesus and is walking in another gospel, following another Jesus, then it would only make sense that Jesus, the Son of the Living God, would not recognise them! Jesus will take that robe from him and cast him out, saying, "I never knew you! Depart from me!"

      Also, it is important to understand HOW Jesus will come back. In order to understand that, one must understand Revelation Chapter 12;
      Revelation 12 (King James Version)

      Revelation 12
      1And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:

      2And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.

      3And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.

      4And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.

      5And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

      6And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

      7And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

      8And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.

      9And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

      10And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

      11And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

      12Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

      13And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.

      14And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.

      15And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.

      16And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.

      17And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

      Lets take a look at Mark 16:9

      Mark 16:9-14 (King James Version)

      9Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.

      10And she went and told them that had been with him, as they mourned and wept.

      11And they, when they had heard that he was alive, and had been seen of her, believed not.

      12After that he appeared in another form unto two of them, as they walked, and went into the country.

      13And they went and told it unto the residue: neither believed they them.

      14Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.

      Jesus appeared to a woman first, out of whom He had cast seven devils! This is very symbolic. It represents what will happen when He returns this time! Read verses 5&6 of Revelation chapter 12 again. Ask yourself, "Why was it important to clarify how many demons had He(Jesus)cast out of Mary Magdeline?"
      When Mary told the disciples that she had seen Him, they did not believe her! Jesus appeared in another form to two others as they were walking. They did not recognise Him! So, when He appears to the eleven, He upbraided them for not believing!

      The same will happen this time! Many who are looking for His return will not believe that He is even here!


      King James Version (KJV)
      Public Domain

      Comment


      • #4
        Posted by Blane

        Originally Posted by Katherine

        Jesus appeared to a woman first, out of whom He had cast seven devils! This is very symbolic. It represents what will happen when He returns this time! Read verses 5&6 of Revelation chapter 12 again. Ask yourself, "Why was it important to clarify how many demons had He(Jesus)cast out of Mary Magdeline?"
        When Mary told the disciples that she had seen Him, they did not believe her! Jesus appeared in another form to two others as they were walking. They did not recognise Him! So, when He appears to the eleven, He upbraided them for not believing!

        The same will happen this time! Many who are looking for His return will not believe that He is even here!

        Thanks for your reply, Katherine. What is your interpretation of the following?

        Christ's coming will be as lightning that goes across the sky from east to west. Every eye will see him, even those who pierced him. All his enemies will wail because of him.

        1611
        Last edited by Lou Newton; October 23, 2014, 11:04 AM.

        Comment


        • #5
          Posted by Blane:

          Originally Posted by Serena
          I looked up lightening in the concordance and found out that it is a bright light. So it will be a bright light from the east to the west.
          Thanks Serena. The verse appears twice:

          Mt 24:27
          For as the lightning cometh out of the east and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

          Lk 17:24
          For as the lightning that lighteneth out of the one part under heaven, shineth unto the other part of heaven; so also shall the Son of man be in his day.

          Blane

          Comment


          • #6
            WROTE TODAY - I pondered if I should even include this post, but it includes several statements that I disagree with and so included it to show why - Lou

            Posted by Katherine -The garments Jesus is referring to is His robe of Righteousness that the saints wear. Many people who are wearing these robes, do so unworthy. When Jesus comes, He will come this time as Judge! As far a Todd [email protected]#$%$ is concerned, he is wearing one of these robes!

            I believe that the scriptures have more then one meaning to them. If someone claims to have received Jesus and is walking in another gospel, following another Jesus, then it would only make sense that Jesus, the Son of the Living God, would not recognise them! Jesus will take that robe from him and cast him out, saying, "I never knew you! Depart from me!"
            The scripture about these robes ARE PARABLES. Jesus is NOT speaking of natural robes, just as He was NOT speaking of about bread, when he said "beware the yeast of the Pharisees".

            The robe was simply a COVERING to show that no one can enter without being COVERED by His Blood.

            In the parable no one had a ROBE taken from them. One was thrown out for not having a robe.

            NO ONE THAT IS COVERED WITH THE BLOOD OF JESUS WILL EVER HAVE THAT COVERING TAKEN AWAY

            Mathew 22
            The Parable of the Wedding Banquet

            1 Jesus spoke to them again in parables, saying: 2 "The kingdom of heaven is like a king who prepared a wedding banquet for his son. 3 He sent his servants to those who had been invited to the banquet to tell them to come, but they refused to come. 4 "Then he sent some more servants and said, 'Tell those who have been invited that I have prepared my dinner: My oxen and fattened cattle have been butchered, and everything is ready. Come to the wedding banquet.' 5 "But they paid no attention and went off--one to his field, another to his business. 6 The rest seized his servants, mistreated them and killed them. 7 The king was enraged. He sent his army and destroyed those murderers and burned their city.
            The one's who were invited, but would not come, are the Jews. They "seized his servants, mistreated them and killed them". His servants being His disciples, apostles, and prophets. The army that the King sent was the Romans.

            8 "Then he said to his servants, 'The wedding banquet is ready, but those I invited did not deserve to come. 9 Go to the street corners and invite to the banquet anyone you find.' 10 So the servants went out into the streets and gathered all the people they could find, both good and bad, and the wedding hall was filled with guests. 11 "But when the king came in to see the guests, he noticed a man there who was not wearing wedding clothes. 12 'Friend,' he asked, 'how did you get in here without wedding clothes?' The man was speechless. 13 "Then the king told the attendants, 'Tie him hand and foot, and throw him outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.' 14 "For many are invited, but few are chosen."
            Here His servants are His disciples and the apostles. We are to go into the streets and invite everyone, both good and bad. For all are bad, are we not. But anyone that is not COVERED with The Blood of Jesus ( his robe) will be thrown out into the darkness.

            But anyone covered with the blood of Jesus will sit at the table of the marriage supper of the Lamb. After all they are His Bride.

            posted by Katherine - Jesus appeared to a woman first, out of whom He had cast seven devils! This is very symbolic. It represents what will happen when He returns this time! Read verses 5&6 of Revelation chapter 12 again. Ask yourself, "Why was it important to clarify how many demons had He(Jesus)cast out of Mary Magdeline?"
            When Mary told the disciples that she had seen Him, they did not believe her! Jesus appeared in another form to two others as they were walking. They did not recognise Him! So, when He appears to the eleven, He upbraided them for not believing!

            The same will happen this time! Many who are looking for His return will not believe that He is even here!
            While this did take place when Jesus was born of a woman and shed His blood for us; this is NOT what takes place in His return:

            Matthew 24
            21 For then there will be great distress, unequaled from the beginning of the world until now--and never to be equaled again. 22 If those days had not been cut short, no one would survive, but for the sake of the elect those days will be shortened. 23 At that time if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ!' or, 'There he is!' do not believe it. 24 For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect--if that were possible. 25 See, I have told you ahead of time. 26 "So if anyone tells you, 'There he is, out in the desert,' do not go out; or, 'Here he is, in the inner rooms,' do not believe it. 27 For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. 28 Wherever there is a carcass, there the vultures will gather
            Jesus describes the Great Tribulation here. Then Jesus tells us that if you did not see Him coming in the clouds as fast as lighting flashes across the sky, then he has not returned yet. NO ONE WILL HAVE TO TELL ANYONE WHEN JESUS RETURNS. EVERYONE WILL SEE HIM.

            NOTICE it does NOT say that a lighting bolt will be a sign of His coming as some claim. BUT it says that His return will be LIKE a lighting bolt flashes across the sky, or at the speed of light. When Jesus returns the other side of the earth will know in a small fraction of second. If I say, "he is a fast as lighting"; I do NOT mean he turned into a lighting bolt. But simply he is very fast.

            Matthew 24
            29 "Immediately after the distress of those days " 'the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from the sky, and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.' 30 "At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and all the nations of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky, with power and great glory. 31 And he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other
            IMMEDIATLY AFTER THE GREAT TRIBULATION THE SON OF MAN WILL APPEAR IN THE SKY.

            WHO WILL SEE HIM - ALL THE NATIONS OF THE EARTH

            HOW WILL JESUS RETURN - IN GREAT POWER AND GLORY

            AFTER ALL OF THIS
            - " he will send his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds"

            Grace to you
            Lou Newton
            Last edited by Lou Newton; October 23, 2014, 01:52 PM.

            Comment


            • #7
              posted by friend01

              My feeling is that as of now this world is in a mess and as the time gets closer to the time of the return of our Savior things are going to be in total chaos and many people Christians not withstanding are going to be so pre-occupied with things happening that they will not be prepared (concerned with more earthly things) when Jesus returns.

              Comment


              • #8
                posted by looking4truth


                "But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, but My Father only. But as the days of Noah were, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. For as in the days before the flood, they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and did not know until the flood came and took them all away, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. Then two men will be in the field: one will be taken and the other left. Two women will be grinding at the mill: one will be taken and the other left. Watch therefore, for you do not know what hour your Lord is coming. But know this, that if the master of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched and not allowed his house to be broken into. Therefore you also be ready, for the Son of Man is coming at an hour you do not expect." Matthew 24:36-44

                To those who do not discern the signs of the times, He will come as a thief in that they will not expect Him to return either from unbelief or ignorance. The elect, however, should recognize the signs of His coming and be ready.
                __________________
                The most dangerous lie is that which most closely resembles the truth. *Jan Groenveld* Founder, Cult Awareness and Information Centre
                "Truth is only hate if you will not yield to it." *Bryan Hupperts*

                Comment


                • #9
                  posted by 777victory

                  Reading this thread this passage of scripture from 2 Peter 3 comes to mind:

                  2 Peter 3
                  1This second epistle, beloved, I now write unto you; in both which I stir up your pure minds by way of remembrance:

                  2That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour:

                  3Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,

                  4And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.

                  5For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:

                  6Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:

                  7But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

                  8But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

                  9The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

                  10But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. 11Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

                  12Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

                  13Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

                  14Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.

                  15And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;

                  16As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

                  17Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.

                  18But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.
                  __________________
                  Vickie

                  HE DIED FOR YOU, WHY NOT LIVE FOR HIM 1 JOHN 3.16

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Posted by Lou Newton on 8-01-2010

                    Blane,

                    I remember when I first joined WC that some woman claimed to have a dream that the second seal had just been opened. I think she was speaking totally in the flesh, for the first four seals were opened while Adam was in the garden.

                    The Revelation is NOT about the future. It is not about time. It is a summary of THE REVELATION OF THE LORD JESUS. This started in Genesis 1:1. In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. The heavens and the earth DECLARE THE GLORY OF GOD. OR they REVEAL The Lord Jesus. The book includes the past, the present, and the future.

                    The Bible is about The Lord Jesus revealing Himself to man. As soon as He created Adam The Lord Jesus came and walked and talked in the garden with Adam to reveal Himself to him.

                    When Adam sinned The Lion of Judah came riding out of heaven riding on a white horse with a crown and a bow. He was not going to leave Satan have Adam and came to conquer him. For Adam had been conquered by Satan.

                    Jesus rode into the garden and shot three arrows into the heart of each of the three. These arrows were the three horseman that followed Jesus out of heaven. War, famine, and disease ( or death, with death being the final disease)

                    The red horse was WAR

                    The black horse was FAMINE

                    The pale horse was DEATH and DISEASE

                    14 So the LORD God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this,
                    "Cursed are you above all the livestock
                    and all the wild animals!
                    You will crawl on your belly (DISEASE)
                    and you will eat dust
                    all the days of your life. (FAMINE)

                    15 And I will put enmity .... (WAR)
                    between you and the woman,
                    and between your offspring and hers
                    ;

                    he will crush your head, (DEATH)
                    and you will strike his heel."

                    16 To the woman he said,
                    "I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing;
                    with pain you will give birth to children. (DISEASE)

                    Your desire will be for your husband,....(FAMINE)
                    and he will rule over you."...(WAR)

                    17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate from the tree about which I commanded you, 'You must not eat of it,'
                    "Cursed is the ground because of you;...(WAR)
                    through painful toil you will eat of it
                    all the days of your life.


                    18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you,...(FAMINE)
                    and you will eat the plants of the field.

                    19 By the sweat of your brow
                    you will eat your food
                    until you return to the ground, (DEATH)
                    since from it you were taken;
                    for dust you are
                    and to dust you will return.

                    Satan got the disease of crawling on his belly AND death.

                    Eve got the disease of pain in childbirth AND death, because she was still of mankind.

                    Adam who was not in the original rebellion got death.

                    The coming of WAR, FAMINE, AND DISEASE (OR DEATH) are NOT future events, but they came in the garden to turn man from his sin and back to The Lord Jesus. They will be here on this earth until the Lord brings total victory over death, new bodies that do not get sick and die, and peace with Satan defeated.

                    So we are a lot further along on the time table than most think.

                    Grace to you - Lou Newton
                    Last edited by Lou Newton; October 23, 2014, 01:53 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      posted by Blane

                      Originally Posted by lounewton
                      Blane,

                      I remember when I first joined WC that some woman claimed to have a dream that the second seal had just been opened. I think she was speaking totally in the flesh, for the first four seals were opened while Adam was in the garden.

                      The Revelation is NOT about the future. It is not about time. It is a summary of THE REVELATION OF THE LORD JESUS. This started in Genesis 1:1. In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. The heavens and the earth DECLARE THE GLORY OF GOD. OR they REVEAL The Lord Jesus. The book includes the past, the present, and the future.

                      The Bible is about The Lord Jesus revealing Himself to man. As soon as He created Adam The Lord Jesus came and walked and talked in the garden with Adam to reveal Himself to him. Thanks for your post.

                      Lou, a very interesting perspective. I certainly agree that the Book of Revelation is not about time, but rather about the Lord Jesus Christ revealing himself to those who love him.

                      Blane/1611

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        posted by Blane

                        Originally Posted by looking4truth
                        "But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, but My Father only. But as the days of Noah were, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. For as in the days before the flood, they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, and did not know until the flood came and took them all away, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. Then two men will be in the field: one will be taken and the other left. Two women will be grinding at the mill: one will be taken and the other left. Watch therefore, for you do not know what hour your Lord is coming. But know this, that if the master of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched and not allowed his house to be broken into. Therefore you also be ready, for the Son of Man is coming at an hour you do not expect." Matthew 24:36-44

                        To those who do not discern the signs of the times, He will come as a thief in that they will not expect Him to return either from unbelief or ignorance. The elect, however, should recognize the signs of His coming and be ready.
                        Looking4truth,

                        Thank you for this response...it makes perfect sense.

                        1611

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          posted by Lou

                          Kathy,

                          You wrote:

                          The garments Jesus is referring to is His robe of Righteousness that the saints wear. Many people who are wearing these robes, do so unworthy. When Jesus comes, He will come this time as Judge! As far a Todd [email protected]#$%$ is concerned, he is wearing one of these robes! We are told in Matthew 7:22 these words of the Lord;
                          Todd Bently or no other man will have a robe taken from them. There is no other way to be righteous except to be covered with the blood of The Lord Jesus. EVERYONE covered with that blood is righteous in the sight of the Lord. That robe is His righteousness that covers us when we trust in His blood.

                          In the parable of the wedding feast, The Lord had a man thrown out FOR NOT HAVING A ROBE.

                          11"But when the king came in to see the guests, he noticed a man there who was not wearing wedding clothes. 12'Friend,' he asked, 'how did you get in here without wedding clothes?' The man was speechless.

                          13"Then the king told the attendants, 'Tie him hand and foot, and throw him outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.'

                          14"For many are invited, but few are chosen."
                          You wrote:
                          The same will happen this time! Many who are looking for His return will not believe that He is even here!
                          When Jesus returns, it is THE REVELATION and every single being in the universe will know of His return. Even Satan will know it is Jesus and he will bow and confess that Jesus is Lord.

                          Grace to you - Lou Newton

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            posted by Lou

                            Kathy,

                            The Holy Spirit is God, but God came in the flesh. Any teaching that says that God did not come in the flesh is from antichrist.

                            Jesus was God in The flesh. His BODY was raised from the dead and ascended in to heaven. And we are told that Jesus will return in that same way. IN THE BODY.

                            The Temple is NOT God. We are His temple here on the earth UNTIL HE RETURNS. Our temples only contain the Holy Spirit and we are NOT The Lord Jesus and NEVER WILL BE.

                            Grace to you - Lou Newton

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              posted by Lou

                              Originally Posted by 777victory
                              Reading this thread this passage of scripture from 2 Peter 3 comes to mind:

                              2 Peter 3
                              1This second epistle, beloved, I now write unto you; in both which I stir up your pure minds by way of remembrance:

                              2That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour:

                              3Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,

                              4And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.

                              5For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:

                              6Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:

                              7But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

                              8But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

                              9The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

                              10But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
                              11Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

                              12Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

                              13Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

                              14Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.

                              15And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;

                              16As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

                              17Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.

                              18But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.
                              AMEN VICKIE, ..................Lou

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