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The three acts of creation - the 3 parts of our being - the three steps of salvation

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  • The three acts of creation - the 3 parts of our being - the three steps of salvation

    **This was originally posted on another thread. But this topic is deserving of it's own thread, so it has been moved from where it was posted originally. Hopefully this thread will be useful for anyone who has any questions about the fact that we are made up of three parts, body, soul, and spirit.**
    Travis



    Please be praying to The Lord while you read this. Only The Holy Spirit can reveal this to anyone.

    The spirit and soul are NOT the same. God is spirit and we are the only creature God created in Genesis 1 that has a spirit. Man is the only creature that God said was created in God's image. So no other creature from Genesis 1 has a spirit.

    We know this from several sources, but Genesis 1 tells us. There are three acts of creation listed in Genesis 1:

    Genesis 1
    The Beginning
    1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters. 3 And God said, "Let there be light," and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light "day," and the darkness he called "night." And there was evening, and there was morning--the first day. 6 And God said, "Let there be an expanse between the waters to separate water from water." 7 So God made the expanse and separated the water under the expanse from the water above it. And it was so. 8 God called the expanse "sky." And there was evening, and there was morning--the second day. 9 And God said, "Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear." And it was so. 10 God called the dry ground "land," and the gathered waters he called "seas." And God saw that it was good. 11 Then God said, "Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to their various kinds." And it was so. 12 The land produced vegetation: plants bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good. 13 And there was evening, and there was morning--the third day. 14 And God said, "Let there be lights in the expanse of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark seasons and days and years, 15 and let them be lights in the expanse of the sky to give light on the earth." And it was so. 16 God made two great lights--the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars. 17 God set them in the expanse of the sky to give light on the earth, 18 to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19 And there was evening, and there was morning--the fourth day. 20 And God said, "Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the expanse of the sky." 21 So God created the great creatures of the sea and every living and moving thing with which the water teems, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good. 22 God blessed them and said, "Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the water in the seas, and let the birds increase on the earth." 23 And there was evening, and there was morning--the fifth day. 24 And God said, "Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: livestock, creatures that move along the ground, and wild animals, each according to its kind." And it was so. 25 God made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good. 26 Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground." 27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them. 28 God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and over every living creature that moves on the ground." 29 Then God said, "I give you every seed-bearing plant on the face of the whole earth and every tree that has fruit with seed in it. They will be yours for food. 30 And to all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air and all the creatures that move on the ground--everything that has the breath of life in it--I give every green plant for food." And it was so. 31 God saw all that he had made, and it was very good. And there was evening, and there was morning--the sixth day.
    So we see that God CREATED three different times in Genesis 1.

    The word CREATED is used when God creates something out of nothing.

    When God then forms something out of the matter that He created in His first act of creation, He uses the word MADE or LET THERE BE.

    The first act of creation is when God created the heavens and the earth. There is nothing in this material universe that you can name that is not included in the heavens and the earth. So that is all of the matter and energy in the universe that God created in His first act of creation. But of course God still had to form that matter into things like the earth. That is why God tells us that the earth was WITHOUT FORM. It was not formed yet from the matter God created in the beginning.

    Second act of creation - This was when God created the great sea creatures and other large animals. We can learn from being with animals that some have emotions, intellect, and a will. Anyone that has hade a dog or cat can see this. You certainly can hurt their feeling which means they have emotions. They certainly have an intellect, although much less than man. And sometimes they do not do what we tell them to do, or they have a will.

    So when God said let the earth bring forth the animals, the earth brought forth animals. Bacteria, and then more and more complicated forms of life came from the earth, just as God said. These living things did not have a soul, so no act of creation was needed for them. But when large animals came forth they needed a soul and a second act of creation was needed. So God CREATED the soul for these animals.

    This shows us that the SOUL is not made up of ordinary matter or even energy. Because God created all matter and energy in the beginning. Man does not know what the soul is made from yet today. But we know that the soul still lives on after the death of the body. ( see my article on this subject http://www.fortressoftruth.com/forums/showthread.php?34-Does-the-soul-live-on-after-the-flesh-dies)

    But when God created man, the man was to be created in God's image. God is Spirit, so man had to have a spirit. That meant that the 3rd act of creation was needed to create the spirit for man.

    This shows us that the spirit is not made up of the same thing the soul is made up of. For it took another act of creation. The spirit is not of this material universe and neither is the soul. For if they were another act of creation would not have been needed for either. God would have just formed them from the matter and energy He created in the beginning.

    NOTICE that it took ONE act of creation to create the universe. It took two acts of creation to create the animals. But man took three acts of creation to create man. Notice that God use the word create three times when He speaks of creating man.

    Now since man was created in the image of God and so had to have a spirit, man also had to look like God, or his body looked the same as God's body. But God is ONE person (person pertaining to personality) but has three parts to that one being. The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit. But they are not three, but one. It is not God is three persons that is by some black magic also ONE. God is one person that has three "parts". We must remember that we are speaking of God here and He is far beyond our understanding. So I use the word "parts" but words fall short in trying to explain God.

    Mark 12
    28 One of the teachers of the law came and heard them debating. Noticing that Jesus had given them a good answer, he asked him, "Of all the commandments, which is the most important?" 29 "The most important one," answered Jesus, "is this: 'Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one.
    Isaiah 9
    6 For unto us a child is born, and unto us a Son is given: and the government is upon his shoulder, and he shall call his name, Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The prince of peace.
    Isaiah 43
    ." 10 "You are my witnesses," declares the LORD, "and my servant whom I have chosen, so that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor will there be one after me. 11 I, even I, am the LORD, and apart from me there is no savior.
    Since God has three parts to His one being. Man had to have three parts to be created in His image.

    So man had to have a body, which it seems from the scriptures that the earth produced. That is why is says God MADE MAN before He mentions that He created man. God made the body for man out of the earth.

    Then the soul was already created for the animals. So no act of creation was needed for the soul.

    But if one looks with care in Genesis 2 they will see that God says He breathed the breath of LIFE into man.

    7 the LORD God formed the man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being
    We see that God first FORMED man, and then BREATHED the breath of life into man.

    What is LIFE. That is the SPIRIT. God is SPIRIT and God is LIFE.

    We can see The Lord Jesus doing the same thing for the disciples, when they were BORN AGAIN.

    John 20
    21 Again Jesus said, "Peace be with you! As the Father has sent me, I am sending you." 22 And with that he breathed on them and said, "Receive the Holy Spirit
    They were dead in the spirit, so Jesus breathed on them to bring LIFE to their spirit. Notice Jesus did this the same exact way He brought LIFE to Adam. Jesus was showing all that He was the same God who breathed LIFE into Adam.

    So man has a body, a soul, and a spirit. The body is simply matter. The spirit is spirit as God is spirit. The soul is the will, the intellect, and the emotions.

    I feel sure most will need much more to back this up, but I had to start somewhere.

    To answer your question about the born again soul. The soul never died, so it does not have to be born again. It is the spirit that died, and it has to be born again. But the soul does need to be saved. For our souls have been corrupted by our rebellion against God. But that will be the subject of another post.

    Please ask any questions that you must certainly have.

    Grace to you
    Lou Newton
    Bond servant of Jesus
    Last edited by Lou Newton; August 31, 2014, 11:00 PM.

  • #2
    Originally posted by LouNewton
    They were dead in the spirit, so Jesus breathed on them to bring LIFE to their spirit. Notice Jesus did this the same exact way He brought LIFE to Adam. Jesus was showing all that He was the same God who breathed LIFE into Adam.

    So man has a body, a soul, and a spirit. The body is simply matter. The spirit is spirit as God is spirit. The soul is the will, the intellect, and the emotions.

    I feel sure most will need much more to back this up, but I had to start somewhere.

    To answer your question about the born again soul. The soul never died, so it does not have to be born again. It is the spirit that died, and it has to be born again. But the soul does need to be saved. For our souls have been corrupted by our rebellion against God. But that will be the subject of another post.

    Please ask any questions that you must certainly have.
    Interesting observation, Lou. Psalm 23 speaks of God restoring our soul. Jesus also warns against the futility of gaining the whole world and yet losing ones soul. So, you're right. How can a person lose something they never had in the first place? (soul) And why must a man's spirit be born again from above, except it is currently dead?

    Blane

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Blane View Post
      Interesting observation, Lou. Psalm 23 speaks of God restoring our soul. Jesus also warns against the futility of gaining the whole world and yet losing ones soul. So, you're right. How can a person lose something they never had in the first place? (soul) And why must a man's spirit be born again from above, except it is currently dead?

      Blane
      Good observation yourself Blane.

      Hopefully someone will quote more scriptures like you did.

      Lou

      Comment


      • #4
        Many might question or even disagree with much that I wrote in the first post. But one thing I am confidant of is this: while what many scientist teach about evolution is simply blasphemy (for they teach God had nothing to do with the "evolution" of the universe); but also much of what is being taught as Biblical creation is also hogwash.

        This so called Biblical creation that does not agree with scripture at all, is one of the main reasons the church has lost so much credibility in the world.

        Ask yourself these questions:

        1 - Why has the church lost so much credibility in the world.

        The church used to rule much of the world. God says the moon is to rule to night in Genesis 1. The moon is a symbol of the church. The sun is to rule the day. We are the children of the day. The world is the children of the night. Why are we being ruled by them.

        2 - Why are Christian families losing their children to the world.

        If our children are bring taught the truth, the truth should be able to stand against anything.

        These are only two questions that could be asked, there are many more. Our children are taught the wrong interpretation of the creation, or Genesis 1, and then we send them off to college where they find what they were taught is simply not true. They throw the baby out with the bath water and think the Bible is not true.

        THE BIBLE IS HOLY AND WHOLLY TRUE

        Genesis 1
        The Beginning
        1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters. 3 And God said, "Let there be light," and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light "day," and the darkness he called "night." And there was evening, and there was morning--the first day. 6 And God said, "Let there be an expanse between the waters to separate water from water." 7 So God made the expanse and separated the water under the expanse from the water above it. And it was so. 8 God called the expanse "sky." And there was evening, and there was morning--the second day. 9 And God said, "Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear." And it was so. 10 God called the dry ground "land," and the gathered waters he called "seas." And God saw that it was good. 11 Then God said, "Let the land produce vegetation: seed-bearing plants and trees on the land that bear fruit with seed in it, according to their various kinds." And it was so. 12 The land produced vegetation: plants bearing seed according to their kinds and trees bearing fruit with seed in it according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good. 13 And there was evening, and there was morning--the third day. 14 And God said, "Let there be lights in the expanse of the sky to separate the day from the night, and let them serve as signs to mark seasons and days and years, 15 and let them be lights in the expanse of the sky to give light on the earth." And it was so. 16 God made two great lights--the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars. 17 God set them in the expanse of the sky to give light on the earth, 18 to govern the day and the night, and to separate light from darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19 And there was evening, and there was morning--the fourth day. 20 And God said, "Let the water teem with living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the expanse of the sky." 21 So God created the great creatures of the sea and every living and moving thing with which the water teems, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good. 22 God blessed them and said, "Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the water in the seas, and let the birds increase on the earth." 23 And there was evening, and there was morning--the fifth day. 24 And God said, "Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds: livestock, creatures that move along the ground, and wild animals, each according to its kind." And it was so. 25 God made the wild animals according to their kinds, the livestock according to their kinds, and all the creatures that move along the ground according to their kinds. And God saw that it was good.

        But we should be able to see that what The Bible clearly says, let the land produce vegetation, is ignored by many who teach how the creation took place. But when we read further we see this: , "Let the land produce living creatures according to their kinds. Needless to say these same teachers ignore this statement by God Almighty.

        SO WHAT IS THE TRUTH ABOUT THE CREATION

        Le me first state that I used to assume that the 6 - 24 hour day version was correct. But when I read Genesis 1 with this version in mind, my faith was attacked. I would start to wonder if the Bible was even true at all, or just some story that someone made up. But when I would read the gospels, I would have my faith built up and could see that The Bible was true. I did not see that the problem was NOT Genesis 1; the problem was the wrong interpretation I was trying to make it fit into. For they simply did not agree.

        TOTALLY BY THE GRACE OF THE LORD JESUS, I DID THE RIGHT THING - I prayed to Him and asked Him what was the truth about the creation. Why am I having these doubts when I read it. It was not long after that prayer that I was walking in the Oaks Mall in Gainesville Florida and I was passing a book store. The Lord told me to go into the store. I did not know it was Him so I walked by the store. I immediately felt that His Holy Spirit within me was grieved. So I told The Lord I was sorry and went back and walked into the store.

        As I walked down the aisle of the store and looked around, this one book seemed to jump right off of the shelf and come right at me. I was stunned and walked up to it. It was a Rand McNally Atlas of the World. The Lord said, "buy this book". I looked through it and was surprised to see an explanation of how the solar system was formed in the first part of it. This was that evil science and I was surprised that The Lord would tell me to buy this book. It was a very large and expensive book so I resisted buying it.

        So I prayed and told the Lord, I will look around the store and if this is NOT you telling me to buy this book, please cause me to forget all about it. But if it is You telling me to buy it, please keep on reminding me about it. So I soon forgot about it while looking at other books. But as I started to walk out, The Lord said, "do not forget that book". So I went back and bought it. If I remember it was $60 which was a lot of money back in 1985.

        When I got home and studied the explanation of how the solar system started, I was surprised and amazed. I could not help but be interested. So I dove into the explanation that was presented while praying about the whole thing continuously. I asked The Lord to please keep me from deception. I found out that this was based on observation by our very large telescopes. A few years later The Hubble confirmed these observations with great clarity. They had actually seen other solar systems being formed. They seen them in all stages. So they knew that stars started by two very large gas clouds colliding and then starting to rotate after they collided. Over many years gravity did it's work and the gas cloud got smaller and denser. As this took place a large disc would appear around the proto star that would form the planets. When the star got dense enough nuclear fusion would start, and it would produce light. The star then would put off a solar wind and blow the dust out of the disc where the planets were. It was then that the star could be seen from the planets of that star. Before the solar wind started the dust in the planet disc was too thick to be able to see the star from the planet.

        Now I am writing this in a short paragraph, but it took me years to start to see and accept this. It was in my study of the Scriptures that The Lord was able to make this blind man see. I finally was able to see that Genesis 1 agreed with this observation of The Lord 's creation.

        Evil men draw evil conclusions while they observe God's creation. This is because they are not humble and do not seek the truth, but seek to justify themselves. But The Promise of The Lord is that if we seek the truth, we will find the truth.

        The creation is not evil, for God created it. The creation reveals the glory of God.

        Psalm 19
        For the director of music. A psalm of David.
        1 The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of his hands. 2 Day after day they pour forth speech; night after night they display knowledge. 3 There is no speech or language where their voice is not heard. 4 Their voice goes out into all the earth, their words to the ends of the world. In the heavens he has pitched a tent for the sun, 5 which is like a bridegroom coming forth from his pavilion, like a champion rejoicing to run his course. 6 It rises at one end of the heavens and makes its circuit to the other; nothing is hidden from its heat. 7 The law of the LORD is perfect, reviving the soul. The statutes of the LORD are trustworthy, making wise the simple. 8 The precepts of the LORD are right, giving joy to the heart. The commands of the LORD are radiant, giving light to the eyes. 9 The fear of the LORD is pure, enduring forever. The ordinances of the LORD are sure and altogether righteous. 10 They are more precious than gold, than much pure gold; they are sweeter than honey, than honey from the comb. 11 By them is your servant warned; in keeping them there is great reward. 12 Who can discern his errors? Forgive my hidden faults. 13 Keep your servant also from willful sins; may they not rule over me. Then will I be blameless, innocent of great transgression. 14 May the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart be pleasing in your sight, O LORD, my Rock and my Redeemer.
        Please read this whole psalm with great care. It was written by the prophet David ( who was also King, so he could not hold the office of prophet) David paid a great price to learn these things that he wrote about.

        We should be able to see that God created the universe to reveal His glory to mankind. The Bible is not the only revelation from God; for so is His creation.

        GOD'S HOLY SCRIPTURES AND GOD'S CREATION NEVER DISAGREE, EVEN ON ONE POINT

        Much more to come in the next post.

        Grace to you
        Lou Newton
        Bond servant of Jesus

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Lou Newton View Post
          Then the soul was already created for the animals. So no act of creation was needed for the soul.
          Hey Lou,

          So, our soul is kind of on the same level as animals then in many ways?

          Travis

          Comment


          • #6
            The origin of the earth centered creation story

            Originally posted by Travis View Post
            Hey Lou,

            So, our soul is kind of on the same level as animals then in many ways?

            Travis
            Boy, Travis you come up with some of the best questions.

            I had never once thought of that before.

            If we think of the 1st act of creation, In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

            God created all of the matter and energy in the universe in that instant.

            Later from that same act, God said, let the earth produce plants, and later, let the earth produce animals.

            Now animals are a much "higher" life form than molecules. But you are correct they are on the same level in some ways.

            For both are made up of atoms.

            So it may be that our soul is far more complicated than that of animals, but both may be made up of the same thing. For no additional act of creation was needed.

            When Isaac (my son) was about 8, I told him I would take him on vacation to any place in the US he wanted to go. He did not hesitate for even a second. He asked, would you take me to the Museum of Natural History in New York. I was very pleased that he did not ask to go to Disney or many other places that most kids would have chose.

            I had already taken him to the one in Pittsburgh and Cleveland. But they do not even come close to the one in NY. It is the largest in the world along with London.( a few years ago he went to London) We had both been studying the dinos and other fossils that had been discovered and wanted to see with our own eyes.

            We seen fossils of these small creatures that walked upright instead of on all fours. They had a larger brain that other animals, but much smaller than men. They made and used tools. These things definitely existed. But even though, it seems they were here for millions of years after they first appeared, they made absolutely no progress in those millions of years.

            Then another species would suddenly appear and it was a little taller and had a larger brain. It was more advanced that the previous species, but it made no progress during the million years it was here. Then another and another etc.

            This ended with the Neanderthal animals ( I do not think these creatures were men) But some call them early man. This creature had a very large brain and was heavier built, but not as tall as modern man (us). The amazing thing is that the Neanderthals were here longer than we have been here since God created man. BUT they made no progress either. Even though they were here for many thousands of years they did not change the way they lived in that time.

            BUT when modern man ( what I call man, and I also think what God calls man) was created and God breathed the breath of life into him ( that was of course the spirit) then man was the ONLY creature to have a spirit.

            From that time till today ( which has been a very short time by anyone's account) there has been a EXPLOSION of progress by man. A very short time after his creation man has built skyscrapers, aircraft, computers, spacecraft, etc.

            SO WHY IS THIS ?

            The difference is that man had a SPIRIT. This is what made man so superior to animals. We are spiritual beings so we can communicate with God.

            In my opinion, Isaac Newton (1643-1727), was the greatest scientist who ever lived. Many experts agree with this. His discoveries dwarf any other man's. I could not list them here. I would have to do research to find most of them, but would still miss many of them. For instance, many are not aware that he invented the reflecting telescope. ( that is the same kind we use today, like Hubble) Issac's life work was NOT science. That was his hobby. His life work was writing about The Bible. His works on the Bible would fill the Encyclopedia Britannica. ( reflecting telescopes are very small and light compared the refracting telescope)

            But Isaac claimed that he did not discover anything. He claimed that all of his discoveries were given to him by God.

            There are many men of old that are held in high esteem, like Plato and Aristotle. But their science was not true. Aristotle thought the sun went around the earth. Men thought him correct for over a thousand years, but he was wrong. The Pope declared that Aristotle was correct, and so anyone who said different was killed.

            THIS WAS HOW THE EARTH CENTERED CREATION WAS STARTED BY THE POPE

            Now it was very Godly and brave men who found the truth.

            Copernicus - a Polish priest who studied the stars for many years and proposed that the earth went around the sun. He said the solar system was NOT earth centered but it was sun centered. He was wise enough to wait until his death to have his servant have his work published.

            Kepler - a very Godly man who was persecuted by the Lutheran Church. He was made to leave his home and property more than once because he did not believe the elements of communion were the literal body and blood of Jesus. He had helped these towns by publishing an almanac that showed when to plant, but they still chased him out of town. But he believed that The Bible said that the sun was the symbol of Jesus, so it had to be in the center, not the earth. So he worked for 20 years to find the formulas that showed how the earth went around the sun.

            Galileo - A man who believed the Bible was totally true. He believed the work of Copernicus and Kepler. So he built a refracting telescope to observe the planets. He was able to discover that Jupiter had four moons that went around it. So he PROVED Copernicus and Kepler were correct. For here were four bodies that did NOT revolve around the earth. The Pope imprisoned him in his house for the rest of his life even though he recanted.

            Newton - He believed the Bible was totally true. He used the discoveries of Copernicus, Kepler, and Galileo to discover calculus and then use it to discover the whole branch of science called Physics. He discovered all of the laws that showed how the heavenly bodies moved through space and also discovered gravity. His many discoveries are too numerous to list here.

            These men all started the scientific revolution that was the foundation of modern science. They all believed the Bible and gave credit to God for their discoveries. They started the sun centered creation.

            So I conclude that all of these creatures that looked something like men, were not men at all. They had no spirit and were NOT created in the image of God. BUT when God breathed the breath of life into Adam that was the first man. It was that spirit that allowed them to communicate with God and change the face of the earth.

            I also conclude that it was when the Pope decided that a heathen, by the name of Aristotle, was correct in saying that the sun went around the earth; that started the whole earth centered creation doctrine. An earth centered creation, of course, requires 6 earth days, and not other kind of days.

            Early church leaders like Augustine believed that the six days of creation were very long periods of time.

            Grace to you
            Lou Newton
            Band servant of Jesus
            Last edited by Lou Newton; September 3, 2014, 06:49 AM.

            Comment


            • #7
              Fascinating topic, Lou

              Originally posted by Lou Newton View Post
              Boy, Travis you come up with some of the best questions.

              I had never once thought of that before.

              If we think of the 1st act of creation, In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

              God created all of the matter and energy in the universe in that instant.

              Later from that same act, God said, let the earth produce plants, and later, let the earth produce animals.

              Now animals are a much "higher" life form than molecules. But you are correct they are on the same level in some ways.

              For both are made up of atoms.

              So it may be that our soul is far more complicated than that of animals, but both may be made up of the same thing. For no additional act of creation was needed.

              When Isaac was about 8, I told him I would take him on vacation to any place in the US he wanted to go. He did not hesitate for even a second. He asked, would you take me to the Museum of Natural History in New York. I was very pleased that he did not ask to go to Disney or many other places that most kids would have chose.

              I had already taken him to the one in Pittsburgh and Cleveland. But they do not even come close to the one in NY. It is the largest in the world along with London.( a few years ago he went to London) We had both been studying the dinos and other fossils that had been discovered and wanted to see with our own eyes.

              We seen fossils of these small creatures that walked upright instead of on all fours. They had a larger brain that other animals, but much smaller than men. They made and used tools. These things definitely existed. But even though, it seems they were here for millions of years after they first appeared, they made absolutely no progress in those millions of years.

              Then another species would suddenly appear and it was a little taller and had a larger brain. It was more advanced that the previous species, but it made no progress during the million years it was here. Then another and another etc.

              This ended with the Neanderthal animals ( I do not think these creatures were men) But some call them early man. This creature had a very large brain and was heavier built, but not as tall as modern man (us). The amazing thing is that the Neanderthals were here longer than we have been here since God created man. BUT they made no progress either. Even though they were here for many thousands of years they did not change the way they lived in that time.

              BUT when modern man ( what I call man, and I also think what God calls man) was created and God breathed the breath of life into him ( that was of course the spirit) then man was the ONLY creature to have a spirit.

              From that time till today ( which has been a very short time by anyone's account) there has been a EXPLOSION of progress by man. A very short time after his creation man has built skyscrapers, aircraft, computers, spacecraft, etc.

              SO WHY IS THIS ?

              The difference is that man had a SPIRIT. This is what made man so superior to animals. We are spiritual beings so we can communicate with God.

              In my opinion, Isaac Newton, was the greatest scientist who ever lived. Many experts agree with this. His discoveries dwarf any other man's. I could not list them here. I would have to do research to find most of them, but would still miss many of them. For instance, many are not aware that he invented the reflecting telescope. ( that is the same kind we use today, like Hubble) Issac's life work was NOT science. That was his hobby. His life work was writing about The Bible. His works on the Bible would fill the Encyclopedia Britannica. ( reflecting telescopes are very small and light compared the refracting telescope)

              But Isaac claimed that he did not discover anything. He claimed that all of his discoveries were given to him by God.

              There are many men of old that are held in high esteem, like Plato and Aristotle. But their science was not true. Aristotle thought the sun went around the earth. Men thought him correct for over a thousand years, but he was wrong. The Pope declared that Aristotle was correct, and so anyone who said different was killed.

              THIS WAS HOW THE EARTH CENTERED CREATION WAS STARTED BY THE POPE

              Now it was very Godly and brave men who found the truth.

              Copernicus - a Polish priest who studied the stars for many years and proposed that the earth went around the sun. He said the solar system was NOT earth centered but it was sun centered. He was wise enough to wait until his death to have his servant have his work published.

              Kepler - a very Godly man who was persecuted by the Lutheran Church. He was made to leave his home and property more than once because he did not believe the elements of communion were the literal body and blood of Jesus. He had helped these towns by publishing an almanac that showed when to plant, but they still chased him out of town. But he believed that The Bible said that the sun was the symbol of Jesus, so it had to be in the center, not the earth. So he worked for 20 years to find the formulas that showed how the earth went around the sun.

              Galileo - A man who believed the Bible was totally true. He believed the work of Copernicus and Kepler. So he built a refracting telescope to observe the planets. He was able to discover that Jupiter had four moons that went around it. So he PROVED Copernicus and Kepler were correct. For here were four bodies that did NOT revolve around the earth. The Pope imprisoned him in his house for the rest of his life even though he recanted.

              Newton - He believed the Bible was totally true. He used the discoveries of Copernicus, Kepler, and Galileo to discover calculus and then use it to discover the whole branch of science called Physics. He discovered all of the laws that showed how the heavenly bodies moved through space and also discovered gravity. His many discoveries are too numerous to list here.

              These men all started the scientific revolution that was the foundation of modern science. They all believed the Bible and gave credit to God for their discoveries. They started the sun centered creation.

              So I conclude that all of these creatures that looked something like men, were not men at all. They had no spirit and were NOT created in the image of God. BUT when God breathed the breath of life into Adam that was the first man. It was that spirit that allowed them to communicate with God and change the face of the earth.

              I also conclude that it was when the Pope decided that a heathen, by the name of Aristotle, was correct in saying that the sun went around the earth; that started the whole earth centered creation doctrine. An earth centered creation, of course, requires 6 earth days, and not other kind of days.

              Early church leaders like Augustine believed that the six days of creation were very long periods of time.

              Grace to you
              Lou Newton
              Band servant of Jesus
              Thanks for starting this thread, Lou. It never ceases to amaze me how irate some believers get when anyone dares to suggest that the Genesis creation account may not involve literal 24 hour days. I don't understand why they feel such an overwhelming drive to label those in the opposing camp, heretics. They insist that challenging the literal six day creation account, and believing that the Bible is fully reliable, are mutually exclusive possibilities. That assumption is simply not true.

              Blane

              Comment


              • #8
                Wow

                Astonishing and humbling content and presentation. I read Genesis 1 I don't know how many times. Studied it. Read about it from learned men. How is it I passed right over these pure and simple details so many times? You are an unusual man, Lou (for which I'm grateful ), and our God is so far above us in knowledge and wisdom. Yet He condescends to show wee little ol' us the immense grandeur of his wonders and glory.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Something innocent has to die for us to have life

                  Originally posted by Baruch View Post
                  Astonishing and humbling content and presentation. I read Genesis 1 I don't know how many times. Studied it. Read about it from learned men. How is it I passed right over these pure and simple details so many times? You are an unusual man, Lou (for which I'm grateful ), and our God is so far above us in knowledge and wisdom. Yet He condescends to show wee little ol' us the immense grandeur of his wonders and glory.
                  Thanks Blane and Baruch for commenting. It is very hard to write when no one comments.

                  I have barely scratched the surface of this subject yet.

                  Even human authors know that the opening passage of a book is the most important, along with the conclusion at the end.

                  God also knows this. The opening passage of the Bible ( Genesis 1) is the most important in The Bible. Everything is there is one can see it.

                  There is no more important thing in Genesis 1 than the revealing of the fact that God would become flesh and die for our sin.

                  1 John 4
                  Test the Spirits
                  1 Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. 2 This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, 3 but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world
                  So by this passage above, if Genesis 1 does not acknowledge that God came in the flesh to die for us, then it is not from God.

                  This is why Satan has deceived so many preachers into preaching their was no death before Adam's sin.

                  That would mean their would be no death in Genesis 1.

                  If no death in Genesis 1, then is does not acknowledge that Jesus came in the flesh and died for us. John tells us that is antichrist.

                  THE MAIN THEME OF GENESIS 1 IS THAT SOMETHING INNOCENT HAS TO DIE FOR US TO HAVE LIFE

                  PS - God has been preparing me for this for almost 40 years. I have been waiting for someplace and someone to preach this to for many years. But I see now I was not totally prepared until now. Jesus is never late.

                  Grace to you
                  Lou Newton

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Blane View Post
                    Thanks for starting this thread, Lou. It never ceases to amaze me how irate some believers get when anyone dares to suggest that the Genesis creation account may not involve literal 24 hour days. I don't understand why they feel such an overwhelming drive to label those in the opposing camp, heretics. They insist that challenging the literal six day creation account, and believing that the Bible is fully reliable, are mutually exclusive possibilities. That assumption is simply not true.

                    Blane
                    1st of all I believe that the creation is six literal days. For the Hebrew word "Yom" means period of time. So these literal days did not have to be earth days.

                    2nd - notice that those who believe that the six days are not 24 hour days, or earth days, do NOT GET ANGRY, and do not mock those who believe in the earth days.

                    Why do some get angry toward those who believe the six days were not earth days. Because we get angry when anyone tries to destroy our idols.

                    No one gets angry when another person even curses The Lord Jesus Christ, who is out Lord and Savior. We get sad, not angry. Jesus is not our Idol, but He is The real God Almighty. We know that He can not be threatened by anyone or anything.

                    But an idol can not walk or talk, so we have to protect our idol. We know this down deep. Also it is God who inspires our faith in Christ. But it is Satan who inspires our belief in errors.

                    So this behavior does not prove error from truth, but it does show WHY someone put faith in something. It is also strong evidence that an error is being believed in.

                    Those that believe in the six earth days, but it is not an idol to them, but only tradition, do not get angry when someone presents another view.

                    Read Judges and how the whole town wanted to kill Gideon for burning their idols. WHY ? Because they knew down deep that these false gods could not protect themselves, so they had to protect their false gods.

                    Why do the Muslims kill those who attack Allah. Because they know that the false god Allah can not protect himself, so they have to protect him.

                    Grace to you
                    Lou newton

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Once again, Lou, you have dropped my jaw with the simplest of statements:

                      Why do some get angry toward those who believe the six days were not earth days. Because we get angry when anyone tries to destroy our idols.
                      This is so true, and so simple. It explains so many encounters (cough confrontations cough) I've had with even my own family about God, religion, and the Bible. Thank you for this one!

                      I'm quite interested and trying to pay attention to how you are explaining creation. Not being too scientific minded, my attitude has always been, "The Bible says it so I believe it". That way I never had to compare evidence vs faith. Imagine my surprise to consider that a day isn't necessarily the 24 hours we know as a day somewhere besides earth.
                      You know not what you do because you know not who He is.
                      - Paul Washer
                      Satan is the angel of knowledge and he does not waste his time on anything for no reason.
                      - Lou Newton

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        What is a DAY ?

                        Originally posted by Jules View Post
                        Once again, Lou, you have dropped my jaw with the simplest of statements:



                        This is so true, and so simple. It explains so many encounters (cough confrontations cough) I've had with even my own family about God, religion, and the Bible. Thank you for this one!

                        I'm quite interested and trying to pay attention to how you are explaining creation. Not being too scientific minded, my attitude has always been, "The Bible says it so I believe it". That way I never had to compare evidence vs faith. Imagine my surprise to consider that a day isn't necessarily the 24 hours we know as a day somewhere besides earth.
                        Thanks Julie,

                        Yes a day on Venus is about one Venus year long. A day of Venus is 243 earth days long, and a Venus year is 224.7 earth days long. So a day on Venus is longer than it's year.

                        A day on Mercury is almost the same length as the year on Mercury.

                        IN FACT EVERY DAY THE SUN STANDS STILL IN THE SKY ON MERCURY

                        Not only does the sun stand still in the sky over Mercury, but the sun actually stops and then goes backwards, and then stops and goes forward again. The sun does this TWICE every day. Now to be able to observe this on Mercury you would have to be standing near one of two areas on that planet.

                        This proves that the miracle that God did for Joshua and the one God did for Hezekiah are possible without breaking any of God's natural laws.

                        Isaiah 38
                        7 “‘This is the Lord’s sign to you that the Lord will do what he has promised: 8 I will make the shadow cast by the sun go back the ten steps it has gone down on the stairway of Ahaz.’” So the sunlight went back the ten steps it had gone down.
                        This was not difficult for God, He has this take place every day on Mercury.

                        A day on Jupiter is only 9.9 hours long. It has the shortest day of any planet in our solar system.

                        So how long is a solar system day ? Or how long is a day of the Milky Way. We think a Milky Way day (our galaxy not the candy bar) is about 250,000,000 earth years long. That is how long our galaxy takes to make one revolution.

                        WHAT IS A DAY

                        day
                        /dā/

                        noun

                        noun: day; plural noun: days
                        1.
                        a period of twenty-four hours as a unit of time, reckoned from one midnight to the next, corresponding to a rotation of the earth on its axis.

                        synonyms: a twenty-four-hour period, twenty-four hours

                        "I stayed for a day"
                        •
                        the part of a day when it is light; the time between sunrise and sunset.

                        "she sleeps all day and goes out at night
                        "


                        synonyms: daytime, daylight;

                        waking hours

                        "enjoy the beach during the day"

                        antonyms: night
                        •
                        the part of a day spent working.

                        "he works an eight-hour day"
                        •
                        Astronomy

                        a single rotation of a planet in relation to its primary.
                        •
                        Astronomy

                        the period on a planet when its primary star is above the horizon.
                        •
                        archaic

                        daylight.

                        "by the time they had all gone it was broad day
                        "
                        2.
                        a particular period of the past; an era.

                        "the laws were very strict in those days"

                        synonyms: period, time, age, era, generation


                        "the leading architect of the day"
                        •
                        the present time.

                        noun: the day

                        "the political issues of the day"
                        •
                        a day associated with a particular event or purpose.

                        "graduation day"
                        •
                        a day's endeavor, or the period of an endeavor, especially as bringing success.

                        "speed and surprise would win the day"
                        •
                        a particular period in a person's life or career.

                        "my student days"
                        •
                        the successful, fortunate, or influential period of a person's life or career.

                        noun: one's day; plural noun: one's days

                        "he had been a matin้e idol in his day"

                        synonyms: heyday, prime, time; More

                        peak, height, zenith, ascendancy;

                        youth, springtime, salad days

                        "in his day he had great influence"

                        antonyms: decline
                        •
                        the span of someone's life.

                        plural noun: one's days

                        "she cared for him for the rest of his days
                        "


                        adjective
                        adjective: day
                        1.
                        carried out during the day as opposed to the evening or at night.

                        "my day job"

                        (of a person) working during the day as opposed to at night.

                        "a day nurse"
                        We can see by the definition of the word "day" it does NOT always mean 24 hours. In fact it sometimes has NOTHING to do with time.

                        I did a days work - Does not mean I worked 24 hours.

                        In my Dad's day - here the word "day" means my Dad's lifetime.

                        Is it day out or night. - Here the word "day' has nothing to do with time, but has to do with LIGHT.

                        THE HEBREW WORD "YOM"

                        The Hebrew word that is translated "day" is the word "yom". The word "yom' simply means a period of time. Some will argue that when Yom is used with a number is means a 24 hour day. But yom is NOT used with a number in the original Hebrew language.

                        Daniel 12
                        11 "From the time that the daily sacrifice is abolished and the abomination that causes desolation is set up, there will be 1,290 days. 12 Blessed is the one who waits for and reaches the end of the "1,335 days. 13 "As for you, go your way till the end. You will rest, and then at the end of the days you will rise to receive your allotted inheritance."
                        If the word "day" in this passage means 24 hours, we all missed the return of Jesus. I do not know anyone who thinks the day here is 24 hours long. In fact there is much discussion between pious Christians about how long these days are.

                        Grace to you
                        Lou Newton
                        Preacher of the gospel of Christ

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          May God's grace and revelation knowledge be revealed in this study...

                          Originally posted by Lou Newton

                          Even human authors know that the opening passage of a book is the most important, along with the conclusion at the end.

                          God also knows this. The opening passage of the Bible ( Genesis 1) is the most important in The Bible. Everything is there is one can see it.

                          There is no more important thing in Genesis 1 than the revealing of the fact that God would become flesh and die for our sin.



                          So by this passage above, if Genesis 1 does not acknowledge that God came in the flesh to die for us, then it is not from God.

                          This is why Satan has deceived so many preachers into preaching their was no death before Adam's sin.

                          That would mean their would be no death in Genesis 1.

                          If no death in Genesis 1, then is does not acknowledge that Jesus came in the flesh and died for us. John tells us that is antichrist.

                          THE MAIN THEME OF GENESIS 1 IS THAT SOMETHING INNOCENT HAS TO DIE FOR US TO HAVE LIFE

                          PS - God has been preparing me for this for almost 40 years. I have been waiting for someplace and someone to preach this to for many years. But I see now I was not totally prepared until now. Jesus is never late.

                          Grace to you
                          Lou Newton
                          Lou,

                          God prepared Moses for 40 years also. By the time God finally called Moses at the burning bush, he had become meek through many years of trials and tribulations, even fleeing for his life. You're so right, Lou. Jesus is never late. I'm really looking forward to learning what God has spent 40 years preparing you to share.

                          Grace and peace,

                          Blane

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Lou Newton View Post
                            Thanks Blane and Baruch for commenting. It is very hard to write when no one comments.

                            I have barely scratched the surface of this subject yet.

                            Even human authors know that the opening passage of a book is the most important, along with the conclusion at the end.

                            God also knows this. The opening passage of the Bible ( Genesis 1) is the most important in The Bible. Everything is there is one can see it.

                            There is no more important thing in Genesis 1 than the revealing of the fact that God would become flesh and die for our sin.



                            So by this passage above, if Genesis 1 does not acknowledge that God came in the flesh to die for us, then it is not from God.

                            This is why Satan has deceived so many preachers into preaching their was no death before Adam's sin.

                            That would mean their would be no death in Genesis 1.

                            If no death in Genesis 1, then is does not acknowledge that Jesus came in the flesh and died for us. John tells us that is antichrist.

                            THE MAIN THEME OF GENESIS 1 IS THAT SOMETHING INNOCENT HAS TO DIE FOR US TO HAVE LIFE

                            PS - God has been preparing me for this for almost 40 years. I have been waiting for someplace and someone to preach this to for many years. But I see now I was not totally prepared until now. Jesus is never late.

                            Grace to you
                            Lou Newton
                            Lou,

                            Thanks for this feast. It is amazing.

                            You stimulated me to dig, and dig deeper. Where!? Where is death in Genesis 1?? I read, I listened, and couldn't see it.

                            Maybe the herbs. They never hurt anyone, those innocent herbs, and they were made meat for every living thing.

                            I guess, but that seems too simple and not quite poignant.

                            Gen 1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

                            Literally: Called God the light Day, and the darkness he called Night, and was the evening and was the morning the first day.

                            How about this curiosity:
                            - choshek, darkness, H2822; see metaphor, "misery, adversity, death".
                            - lilah, Night, H3915; see figurative, "adversity, calamity"; and my Strong's adds literally "a twist (away of the light)".

                            And this curiosity:

                            Gen 1:14-19
                            14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
                            15 And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.
                            16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.
                            17 And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,
                            18 And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.
                            19 And the evening and the morning were the fourth day.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Baruch View Post
                              Lou,

                              Thanks for this feast. It is amazing.

                              You stimulated me to dig, and dig deeper. Where!? Where is death in Genesis 1?? I read, I listened, and couldn't see it.

                              Maybe the herbs. They never hurt anyone, those innocent herbs, and they were made meat for every living thing.

                              I guess, but that seems too simple and not quite poignant.

                              Gen 1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

                              Literally: Called God the light Day, and the darkness he called Night, and was the evening and was the morning the first day.

                              How about this curiosity:
                              - choshek, darkness, H2822; see metaphor, "misery, adversity, death".
                              - lilah, Night, H3915; see figurative, "adversity, calamity"; and my Strong's adds literally "a twist (away of the light)".

                              And this curiosity:

                              Gen 1:14-19
                              14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
                              15 And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.
                              16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.
                              17 And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,
                              18 And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.
                              19 And the evening and the morning were the fourth day.
                              Good questions !

                              Question bring revelations.

                              For Jesus promises that if we seek we will find truth.

                              Lou

                              Comment

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